I dont find it terribly exciting that Gandalf arrived in Middle-earth and was good from the beginning (with Noris help). Thus, while Gandalf taking the One Ring would have expediated the destruction of Sauron, it also would have hasted the subjugation of Middle-earth. Ap. It may not display this or other websites correctly. The Lord of the Rings (LOTR) by J. R. R. Tolkien is one of the greatest and most famous epic fantasy series in English literature. Had Isuldur done the wise thing, and pitched that sucker in the crack of doom, that would have been it. Tolkien edited by Christopher Tolkien. What would have happened to Saruman if Sauron acquired the One Ring? Do you want to be the first who gets the news directly to your mailbox? That he will never do now.". They were basically the teachers pet ones who lived closest to the Valar and did not trouble themselves (except once) with the problems of Middle-Earth. So if Saruman mastered the Ring, he would become the next Dark Lord of Middle-earth. Answer (1 of 3): In short: nobody else could use it against him. Saruman has his own glorious rise to power before falling to ruin. He reasoned that his total control of Middle . In this scenario, Sauron likely would have recovered his Ring and covered all the lands in a second darkness. Sauron would then have suspended his campaign against Minas Tirith, and instead sent his armies north-west, through Rohan towards Isengard. My own feeling is that since it takes time to learn to master the Ring (also Letter 246), Sauron would have had to pay a visit immediately and before Saruman had the time to achieve this mastery. I would think that Saruman, a Maia, would be in that category. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. Saruman wants to be Saurons only servant. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. That was a major concern for Sauron, and one of the reasons he felt constrained to hurry his stroke to gain mastery of the world without the ring. The Rise Of LOTR's Witch-king Of Angmar. The cookie is set by the GDPR Cookie Consent plugin and is used to store whether or not user has consented to the use of cookies. https://www.patreon.com/thebrokensword-----Also if you want to support in a different way then check out our Teespring page where we upload original designs for our merch! I got down on bended knee at the top of the mountain and proposed. He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? Even though Frodo had a 4-5 day head-start further east and would be entering the Dead Marshes on March 1st, Saruman would also have had a head-start on everyone else in terms of knowledge and certainty. So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for science fiction and fantasy enthusiasts. He said yes!" The pair had met through mutual friends years ago, but had an immediate spark when they reconnected last year. The Lord of the Rings; Middle-Earth (Franchise) entertainment news His Spirit would continue in some astral realm, and would use His real weapon: TIME. He sees the Dark Lord as a rival and also an aspiration. But what if the Stranger is a different wizard we all know from The Lord of the Rings? New Movie News, Movie Trailers & upcoming Movie Reviews, Saruman Gaining the One Ring Would Have Doomed Middle-earth Even Faster, Thranduil Was a Jerk - But Lord of the Rings' Only Dark Elf Was Actually Evil, How Morgoth Created Glaurung and The Lord of the Rings' Dragons, REVIEW: Frank Miller Presents Ancient Enemies: The Djinni #1 Crafts a Compelling Origin Story, REVIEW: DC's Shazam! Seem's strange when the ring's main purpose was to rule over the rings/leaders? . When Sauron thought Aragorn had the Ring, he reacted with a swift military offensive. However, The Lord of the Rings TV series still left plenty of questions for future seasons. It may have taken a while to learn to use the Ring to its full potential, and Sauron would surely have put everything he had behind trying to get it back, but itd be iffy, and he certainly couldnt use the Nazgul or other ring-empowered creatures against the weilder of the One. The White Wizard -- at the height of his power -- could have been a match for the Ringless Dark Lord. What would have happened if Saruman had gotten his hands on the One Ring? With possession of the one ring he would have replaced Sauron (would have wiped him out entirely). Would Sauron be able to open two fronts, battling against Isengard and Gondor? The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics". Here's a new theory concerning Saruman and Grima. It didn't have to shoot out lighting bolts to be an uber blade. The implication is that Saruman has to defeat Sauron. A couple of points to add to the excellent arguments thus far: This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. In the books it is mentioned several times that Sauron fears one of the uber good guys getting hold of the Ring. But opting out of some of these cookies may affect your browsing experience. Gandalf & Galadriel admitted they would eventually fall to evil will of Sauron through the One Ring. We see this happening when Frodo claims the Ring at the Crack of Doom, and there's no reason to think it would be different for Saruman. Sarumaon told Gandalf that a new power was rising and noone could srand and therefore they should join that power. However, Saruman had planned his rise to power much earlier than that. You must log in or register to reply here. Exactly. All credit must go to the talented artists. What video game is Charlie playing in Poker Face S01E07? That he will never do now." Saruman with the Ring would presumably have tried to do what Tolkien says Galadriel or Gandalf might have done, if they have succumbed to the temptation of accepting the Ring: Necessary cookies are absolutely essential for the website to function properly. These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. So it is my assumption that Saruman wanted the One Ring so he could forge his own Ring of Power. It was literally Sauron's essence made into an inanimate object. Sauron originally made the One Ring to enhance his ability to influence and suppress or control the wills of other beings, specifically the Children of Ilvatar (Elves, Dwarves, and Men). "In a hole in the ground there lived a rabbit? "Greetings, Naruto Wraithslayer, wielder of the Faerdagnir. His actions were more indirect as his decision was of non-action in not taking Frodo to Minas Tirith. Why does Gandalf seek counsel from Saruman about the One Ring after leaving Frodo in the Shire? #2. Did she think she could have avoided being drawn to Sauron if she did seize the Ring? The one ring would have made him more like what he was before he left on his mission to middle-earth, only corrupted and evil. Did Aragorn ever offer the ring to Frodo? He had also extensively started studying the lore required to make his own ring of power. The content on this site is for entertainment and educational purposes only. Imagine that, after breaking of Fellowship, Saruman`s Uruk-Hai capture Frodo and bring him, with the ring, to Isengard. It does not store any personal data. When the White Council was formed around T.A. On one side the true allegiance of the Ring to Sauron; on the other superior strength because Sauron was not actually in possession, and perhaps also because he was weakened by long corruption and expenditure of will in dominating inferiors. 2023 Minute Media - All Rights Reserved. Tolkiens complex writings and retcons dont reveal a crystal-clear answer about Saruman arriving first, but if you go by The Silmarillion, Saruman did. Did Peter Jackson take inspiration for Gollum from "Dracula 1931" movie. Hes of the same order of beings as Sauron, so he certainly has enough power to effectively use the ring. A normal man with a normal sword would probably have failed miserably even if he had got in the lucky hit. Saruman had full control of his army, which is why the Hobbits were being brought to him (because they maybe had the ring), instead of immediately to Sauron (who at the time of their capture, they were much closer to). That Saruman is nothing like the Stranger who falls from the sky in The Rings of Power. Ultimately, we dont know who the Stranger is, aside from being an Istar, or a wizard. The Uruk-hai capture Frodo and Sam at Amon Hen, thus Saruman gains possession of the most powerful of the Rings of Power, which carries in it, a greater part of Sauron's inherent might. In the case of vague powers the One Ring would enhance one's powers based on one's strengths. Both the direct and symbolic aspects could have helped Saruman expand his empire by winning adherents and frightening potential opponents. One can imagine Lots of great, exclusive content, even discounts on our original merch! How successful would Saruman be finding and capturing the Ringbearer in this scenario is speculative but one has to wonder would Sauron not notice this activity. What Would Happen if Saruman Got the One Ring in LOTR? He definitely volunteered to go to Middle-earth first. His own greed and lust for power turned him to darkness on his own, and Sauron through the Palantir had already turned Saruman into his tool - though Saruman was of no use to Sauron at all once defeated. How did Saruman become corrupted? If Saruman masters the ring, he will have a chance of defeating Sauron. For The War of the Rohirrim anime, one answer might draw on the "canon" of the Peter Jackson films. By the time we meet Saruman in The Lord of the Rings, hes up to no good. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. Tolkien's complex writings and retcons don't reveal a crystal-clear answer about Saruman arriving first, but if you go by The Silmarillion, Saruman did. Short story taking place on a toroidal planet or moon involving flying, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines, The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese, Replacing broken pins/legs on a DIP IC package. It's possible Saruman would have been able to defeat Sauron. Saruman was most skilled in Ring Lore, save Sauron. Sauron was stronger than Gandalf in the Lord of the Rings, but it has to be said that there were a few different shapes of both characters. Thus, the power of the Ring is both direct (like the power of a weapon) and symbolic (like the power of a cult object). Gandalf wasn't even sure if he would be able to break his staff in The Return of the King, and that was a very weakened version of Saruman. We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Latest Blog Post: Jacks Bad Movies Black Adam (2022). If any artists would like us to remove their artwork, or add anything additional to credit you, please contact us and we will sort it straight away! )https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCScfG2CfbSh_LUzkGJ_p-aAHistory of Dragon Ball - (For all things Dragon Ball! Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? On February 26, 3019 Eomer, Third Marshal of the Riddermark, set out against orders from his king to hunt an orc band coming from the east. Got caught and lost a mind-to-mind battle. He only knew an orc band was loose and could cause problems and he feared an alliance between Saruman and Sauron which would be bad for Rohan so off he went. He still had the nine, and perhaps some of the seven. Why does Gollum calling the ring his own not alert Sauron? I think the real point has been missed. 2463, Saruman was appointed its leader.Even then, he had begun to sense the resurgence of Sauron and to envy and desire his power, and especially his One Ring.Coincidentally, in that same year the One Ring was found by the creature Gollum, drawing the Dark Lord closer to the conflict that would eventually prove Saruman's undoing. The thing is, it's worth wondering what would have happened if Frodo had failed. A capable bearer would have all that power, plus whatever native power he or she had to begin with. It's much more likely that Saruman would have used the One Ring for himself and tried to claim Middle-earth as his own. *shrugs*. Functional cookies help to perform certain functionalities like sharing the content of the website on social media platforms, collect feedbacks, and other third-party features. It was never explained how, but the Elves found a way to block Saurons sight from their Rings. Gil Galad, and the last alliance also defeated Sauron, without the help of the Maiar, as well. But he didn't because Eomer disobeyed his king and destroyed an orc band that had the most crucial thing needed by both Saruman and Sauron - information. If Im not mistaken, he is Vanyar? Orcs are poster children for corruption, and plague the Fellowship throughout the novels. He and his servants already knew of his involvement in the attack on the Fellowship and the capture of the hobbits. The villain created The One Ring, where he put most of his power. Either way, Saruman through torture or his Voice would have quickly learned everything about the Quest of the Ring. RELATED: The Lord of the Rings: 10 Details About Sauron's Costume You Never Noticed This incident, one of those that was invented for the film to increase tension, is an incredible missed opportunity for the minions of the Dark . Why are non-Western countries siding with China in the UN? . Saruman joined Sauron only partially. Saruman was corrupted already so was a good candidate for the One Ring, through him it could exert Sauron's will to enslave all Middle-earth. He had already copied Sauron in every other aspect. Here's a hypothesis: Yes, Saruman knew the lore of making such rings but not necessarily the technique (as anyone who has tried to recreate an article based on a knitting or crochet pattern found online can tell you!) So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. Saruman also experimented with the making of a Ring of his own. He believed that Sauron would never return, so he had his own set of schemes. The Mystics, believing the Stranger is Sauron, tell him he must go to Rhn to fully explore his powers. When the Valar realized Sauron had returned, they sent the Istari to help the peoples of Middle-earth. Saruman didn't know what Gandalf wanted to say, but he could guess. Earlier in the same letter we see just exactly how useful the Ring would have been to a hypothetical Ring-bearing Saruman (or anyone else, for that matter): Sauron would not have feared the Ring! What If SARUMAN managed to get his hands on the One Ring and how that . IIRC the idea of Galadriel taking it scared the bejeezus out of him. Performance cookies are used to understand and analyze the key performance indexes of the website which helps in delivering a better user experience for the visitors. The one ring would have made him more like what he was before he left on his mission to middle-earth, only corrupted and evil. He says: "Even reckoned as a lord and captain Saruman has grown very strong Saruman also had a mind to capture the Ring for himself [Sauron] now has Isengard to fear as well as Minas Tirith" The word "fear" seems important here. Either way, the good guys loose big. So it's possible that someone of sufficient power could break the Rings bond to Sauron. He wanted the One Ring. It would be difficult for Sauron. They'd be capable of wielding it and would be a threat to Sauron, though Sauron would probably win in the end as The Ring was only . Or perhaps his lust for power would have blinded him to that? The key thing to note is that Sauron, by the time of the War of the Ring, lacked the ability to take a. I would not be too sure that Sauron would be the victor, as Saruman spent long years in study of ring-lore. But what does Saruman do now? For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. If any being who had the power to use the Ring to its full potential had gotten ahold of it, that being would have been able to easily take on Sauron. Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0, TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History, Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News. Nori even said in the finale that the Stranger was there to help. Is Bosnia a developing or developed country? Yet, he had . RELATED: Thranduil Was a Jerk - But Lord of the Rings' Only Dark Elf Was Actually Evil. Saruman would have made a tasty little morsel for Sauron. Sauron may not learn the true goal of the Ringbearer but he would know that the ringbearer was most likely near or nearing his borders. Does he use his great voice, enhanced by the One to subjugate the free peoples. The One Ring has a number of powers and depending on what information (particularly regarding the Middle Earth RPG) you will get very vague to very specific capabilties for the One Ring. My understanding of the crushingly unavoidable fate which is the history of Middle Earth says that the One Ring belongs to Sauron and no other. Saruman volunteered. Gandalf - open displays of power versus his restrictions as an Istar. All the latest gaming news, game reviews and trailers. The stone had a green/purple coloring. He fought Uruk-hai (who had captured Merry and Pippin thinking they were Frodo) and were enroute to Isengard. Was the "Eye of Sauron" Sauron's actual physical form? Without Gandalf, King Theoden would likely remain under the control of Saruman. In what way? If not for Gandalf, Gondor might've fallen to Sauron. Although Saruman had selfish motives, he didn't expect to fall so deep . This one, too, was controlled by Sauron. Some interesting conjecture, but you're forgetting that if anyone replaced Sauron as the "master" of the One Ruling Ring, they would sever Sauron's tie to the ring and essentially reduce him to an ineffectual spirit who could no longer interact with the physical world. And if the hearts of men were not so easily tainted, the Ringwraiths might never have been brought into being. Today we jump back in time to one of our older videos at one of our What If scenarios! Saruman is ruined when the Riders of Rohan defeat his army and Merry and Pippin prompt the Ents to destroy Isengard. These are not some sort of machine gun, or beam weapon that is just leveled at the enemy, by anyone who happens to wear them. The Rings of Power finale took viewers on a ride with solved mysteries, reunions, and goodbyes. But if Eomer hadn't disobeyed orders? . After a comment from Gimli, Gandalf adds: "But Isengard cannot fight Mordor, unless Saruman first obtains the Ring. On the other hand, if the Stranger is Saruman, consider that journey and how it makes his transformation all the more tragic. Doom to be destroyed and not taken to be used by some great leader. If you preorder a special airline meal (e.g. As was made quite clear at the Council of Elrond, as long as the Ring existed Sauron could not fully be destroyed. Saruman remained in the East for hundreds of years, only returning to the West when Saurons power started to grow. First off, it gives us an idea of how dangerous the Ring is- if the head of the Istari and White Council can . Why Rings of Powers Fight Scenes Are Boring. What TV series related to the "Matter of Middle-earth" would you prefer to see? Please message us if we have not credited you! Got caught and lost a mind-to-mind battle. Will to conquer all life in Middle-earth was the last bit I believe. All of Saruman's scheming nearly came to fruition in The Two Towers. The one, and the nine created fearful dominance, fraught with majesty, and terror. The chapter is a partly published version of a manuscript now held at the Marquette University (MSS 4/2/31-37); [1] other parts of this manuscript and a time scheme have been included in The . We'll pick u. Sauron then spends the rest of his life torturing Saruman for daring to try and take the ring for himself. To a lesser degree Faramir's disobedience also saved the Quest. What happens next would depend on Sauron himself; whether he would seek to retake the Ring immediately; whether he would visit Saruman himself or send a lesser servant. The Great Eye also features heavily in Peter Jacksons blockbuster big-screen adaptations, an ever-watchful flaming orb atop a massive stone obelisk. But there isn't a blind following of obedience in Tolkien at least not with wise and just characters depending on the circumstances. Saruman was known for being subtle in speech (with a powerful ability to sway others with his voice) and skilled in smithcraft. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Imagine that, after breaking of Fellowship, Saruman`s Uruk-Hai capture Frodo and bring him, with the ring, to Isengard. The Lord of the Rings doesnt have plot holes. Instead of sending armies out to take Minas Tirith, Sauron would have had the majority of his forces concentrated on his borders and sweeping the land in front of it with orcs, men, trolls, and Nazgul. Cookie Notice ncdu: What's going on with this second size column? The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance". Who controlled the Seeing Stone of Minas Anor? By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Letter 246 describes a hypothetical confrontation between a hypothetical Ring-bearing Gandalf and Sauron: Confrontation of Sauron alone, unaided, self to self was not contemplated. Sauron once again lay dormant for over a millennium in the Second Age, secretly preparing another attempt to take over Middle-earth. In the book it is sort of implied that certain beings with sufficient power (e.g.